religious state art funds in trouble

Hi folks,
Interesting food for thought from the founders of our great nation.
Best, Eric.

Separation of Church and State? The founding fathers' views on religion and
government (article from the editors at About.com , July 2002)

After the recent flap over the 9th Circuit Court's pledge [of allegiance]
decision, I've received a lot of requests for the thoughts of the Founding
fathers on the issue of Separation of Church and State. At issue is the
belief of many mainstream Christians that separation is a later construct of
the courts, and never intended by the founders. Another prominent argument
is that the founders only opposed the establishment of one Christian sect
over another, and not Christianity as a whole. Yet another popular belief is
that the first amendment only applies to laws restricting religion, and that
the majority should be able to do as they wish, using references to the
'Creator' in documents as a tacit endorsement of Christianity. I believe all
of these arguments to be incorrect, and who better to argue the issue than
the principal author of the constitution, founders themselves?

Quotes are arranged in a question/answer format, to highlight common
arguments.

Argument one: The phrase 'separation of Church and state' is of recent
origin, and the concept was not known or promulgated by the founders.
False. The phrase was first used in Thomas Jefferson's Letter to the Danbury
Baptists:
"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man
and his God, that he owes account to none other for is faith or his worship,
that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not
opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole
American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law
respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise
thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church and State.
Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of
the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress
of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights,
convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties."

James Madison, principal author of the constitution:
"The civil Government, though bereft of everything like an associated
hierarchy, possesses the requisite stability, and performs its functions
with complete success, whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of
the priesthood, and the devotion of the people, have been manifestly
increased by the total separation of the church from the State." (1819).

Argument two: But the founders meant only that no sect of Christianity was
to be elevated above another, but still meant our government to be
Christian…
"Congress should not establish a religion and enforce the legal observation
of it by law, nor compel men to worship God in any manner contrary to their
conscience, or that one sect might obtain a pre-eminence, or two combined
together, and establish a religion to which they would compel others to
conform" (Madison, Annals of Congress, 1789).

"Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity,
in exclusion of all other Religions, may establish with the same ease any
particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects? that the
same authority which can force a citizen to contribute three pence only of
his property for the support of any one establishment, may force him to
conform to any other establishment in all cases whatsoever?" (Madison,
Memorial and Remonstrance)
"Because we hold it for a fundamental and undeniable truth, "that religion
or the duty which we owe to our Creator and the manner of discharging it,
can be directed only by reason and conviction, not by force or violence."
The Religion then of every man must be left to the conviction and conscience
of every man; and it is the right of every man to exercise it as these may
dictate. " (ibid)

"How a regulation so unjust in itself, so foreign to the authority of
Congress, and so hurtful to the sale of public land, and smelling so
strongly of an antiquated bigotry, could have received the countenance of a
committee is truly a matter of astonishment ." (Madison, 1785, letter to
James Monroe, on a failed attempt by congress to set aside public funds to
support churches)

Argument three: But one of the first acts of Congress was to appoint a
Christian chaplain!
This they did do, years before the ratification of the bill of rights.
Madison's objection:
"The establishment of the chaplainship to Congs is a palpable violation of
equal rights, as well as of Constitutional principles: The tenets of the
chaplains elected [by the majority shut the door of worship agst the members
whose creeds & consciences forbid a participation in that of the majority.
To say nothing of other sects, this is the case with that of Roman Catholics
& Quakers who have always had members in one or both of the Legislative
branches. Could a Catholic clergyman ever hope to be appointed a Chaplain!
To say that his religious principles are obnoxious or that his sect is
small, is to lift the evil at once and exhibit in its naked deformity the
doctrine that religious truth is to be tested by numbers or that the major
sects have a right to govern the minor. " (Memorial and Remonstrance)
"If Religion consist in voluntary acts of individuals, singly, or
voluntarily associated, and it be proper that public functionaries, as well
as their Constituents shd discharge their religious duties, let them like
their Constituents, do so at their own expense." (Madison, detached
memoranda, 1820)

"That religion, or the duty we owe to our Creator, and the manner of
discharging it, can be directed only by reason and conviction, not by force
or violence; and therefore all men are equally entitled to the free exercise
of religion, according to the dictates of conscience." (Patrick Henry)

"I am persuaded, you will permit me to observe that the path of true piety
is so plain as to require but little political direction. To this
consideration we ought to ascribe the absence of any regulation, respecting
religion, from the Magna-Charta [Constitution] of our country" (George
Washington, 1789).

"In the course of the opposition to the bill in the House of Delegates,
which was warm & strenuous from some of the minority, an experiment was made
on the reverence entertained for the name & sanctity of the Saviour, by
proposing to insert the words "Jesus Christ" after the words "our lord" in
the preamble, the object of which would have been, to imply a restriction of
the liberty defined in the Bill, to those professing his religion only. The
amendment was discussed, and rejected by a vote of agst." (James Madison,
Memorial and Remonstrance)

"Whilst we assert for ourselves a freedom to embrace, to profess and observe
the Religion which we believe to be of divine origin, we cannot deny equal
freedom to those whose minds have not yet yielded to the evidence which has
convinced us. If this freedom be abused, it is an offense against God, not
against man: To God, therefore, not to man, must an account of it be
rendered." (ibid)

"The appropriation of funds of the United States for the use and support of
religious societies, [is] contrary to the article of the Constitution which
declares that 'Congress shall make no law respecting a religious
establishment'" (James Madison, Veto, 1811)

"It is now no more that toleration is spoken of as if it was by the
indulgence of one class of the people that another enjoyed the exercise of
their inherent natural rights. For happily the Government of the United
States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance,
requires only that those who live under its protection should demean
themselves as good citizens in giving it, on all occasions, their effectual
support." (George Washington, letter to the Touro Synagogue 1790.)

"We should begin by setting conscience free. When all men of all religions
… shall enjoy equal liberty, property, and an equal chance for honors and
power … we may expect that improvements will be made in the human
character and the state of society." (John Adams)

"The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of
governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now
sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture,
hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in
their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American
governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in
America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be
pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the
gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those
at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it
will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by
the use of reason and the senses…." (John Adams, 1787)

"…Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the
natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or
mystery, and which are destined to spread over the northern part of that
whole quarter of the globe, are a great point gained in favor of the rights
of mankind." (ibid)

Further quotes:
"As to religion, I hold it to be the indispensable duty of government to
protect all conscientious protesters thereof, and I know of no other
business government has to do therewith." (Thomas Paine, the Rights of Man)

"All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish
[Muslim], appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and
enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit. I do not mean by this
declaration to condemn those who believe otherwise; they have the same right
to their belief as I have to mine. But it is necessary to the happiness of
man that he be mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not consist in
believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he
does not believe. It is impossible to calculate the moral mischief, if I may
so express it, that mental lying has produced in society. When a man has so
far corrupted and prostituted the chastity of his mind as to subscribe his
professional belief to things he does not believe, he has prepared himself
for the commission of every other crime. He takes up the profession of a
priest for the sake of gain, and in order to qualify himself for that trade
he begins with a perjury. Can we conceive anything more destructive to
morality than this?" (Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason)

US presidents:
"Let it be henceforth proclaimed to the world that man's conscience was
created free; that he is no longer accountable to his fellow man for his
religious opinions, being responsible therefore only to his God." (John
Tyler)

"I am tolerant of all creeds. Yet if any sect suffered itself to be used for
political objects I would meet it by political opposition. In my view church
and state should be separate, not only in form, but fact. Religion and
politics should not be mingled." (Millard Fillmore)
"When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read: "All men are created
equal except negroes, foreigners and Catholics." When it comes to this I
should prefer immigrating to some country where they make no pretence of
loving liberty–to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure,
and without the base alloy of hypocrisy." (Abraham Lincoln)

"Encourage free schools, and resolve that not one dollar of money shall be
appropriated to the support of any sectarian school. Resolve that neither
the state nor nation, or both combined, shall support institutions of
learning other than those sufficient to afford every child growing up in the
land the opportunity of a good common school education, unmixed with
sectarian, pagan, or atheistical tenets. Leave the matter of religion to the
family altar, the church, and the private schools, supported entirely by
private contributions. Keep the church and state forever separated."
(Ulysses S. Grant)

"We all agree that neither the Government nor political parties ought to
interfere with religious sects. It is equally true that religious sects
ought not to interfere with the Government or with political parties. We
believe that the cause of good government and the cause of religion suffer
by all such interference." (Rutherford B. Hayes)

"The divorce between Church and State ought to be absolute. It ought to be
so absolute that no Church property anywhere, in any state or in the nation,
should be exempt from equal taxation; for if you exempt the property of any
church organization, to that extent you impose a tax upon the whole
community." (James A. Garfield)

"Because we are unqualifiedly and without reservation against any system of
denominational schools, maintained by the adherents of any creed with the
help of state aid, therefore, we as strenuously insist that the public
schools shall be free from sectarian influences, and, above all, free from
any attitude of hostility to the adherents of any particular creed."
(Theodore Roosevelt)

"In the experiences of a year of the Presidency, there has come to me no
other such unwelcome impression as the manifest religious intolerance which
exists among many of our citizens. I hold it to be a menace to the very
liberties we boast and cherish." (Warren G. Harding)

"The fundamental precept of liberty is toleration. We cannot permit any
inquisition either from within or from without the law or apply any
religious test to the holding of office. The mind of America must be forever
free." (Calvin Coolidge.)

"I come of Quaker stock. My ancestors were persecuted for their beliefs.
Here they sought and found religious freedom. By blood and conviction I
stand for religious tolerance both in act and in spirit." (Herbert C.
Hoover)

"The lessons of religious toleration–a toleration which recognizes complete
liberty of human thought, liberty of conscience–is one which, by precept
and example, must be inculcated in the hearts and minds of all Americans if
the institutions of our democracy are to be maintained and perpetuated. We
must recognize the fundamental rights of man. There can be no true national
life in our democracy unless we give unqualified recognition to freedom of
religious worship and freedom of education." (Franklin D. Roosevelt)

"Religious and racial persecution is moronic at all times, perhaps the most
idiotic of human stupidities." (Harry S. Truman)

"I believe in an America where the separation of Church and State is
absolute–where no Catholic prelate would tell the President (should he be a
Catholic) how to act, and no Protestant minister would tell his parishioners
for whom to vote–where no church or church school is granted any public
funds or political preference–and where no man is denied public office
merely because his religion differs from the President who might appoint him
or the people who might elect him." (John F. Kennedy)

Another trend I find disturbing is the use of questionable quotes to support
positions that are antithetical to the beliefs of the founders. The
following collection are quotes commonly used to support anti-separation
arguments, none of which can be verified as genuine. Some are outright
fabrications.

Unconfirmed quotes:
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation
was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but
on the gospel of Jesus Christ." attributed to Patrick Henry

"It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible."
attributed to George Washington

"Whosoever shall introduce into the public affairs the principles of
primitive Christianity will change the face of the world." attributed to
Benjamin Franklin

"The principles of all genuine liberty, and of wise laws and administrations
are to be drawn from the Bible and sustained by its authority. The man
therefore who weakens or destroys the divine authority of that book may be
assessory [sic] to all the public disorders which society is doomed to
suffer." attributed to Noah Webster

"There are two powers only which are sufficient to control men, and secure
the rights of individuals and a peaceable administration; these are the
combined force of religion and law, and the force or fear of the bayonet."
attributed to Noah Webster

"The only assurance of our nation's safety is to lay our foundation in
morality and religion." attributed to Abraham Lincoln

"The philosophy of the school room in one generation will be the philosophy
of government in the next." attributed to Abraham Lincoln

"I have always said and always will say that the studious perusal of the
Sacred Volume will make us better citizens. " attributed to Thomas Jefferson


False quotations:
"We have staked the whole future of American civilization, nor upon the
power of government, far from it. We have staked the future of all of our
political institutions upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern
ourselves … according to the Ten Commandments of God."
attributed to James Madison
"Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the
teachings of the redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be

otherwise. In this sense and to this extend, our civilizations and our
institutions are emphatically Christian." attributed to the Supreme Court in
the Holy Trinity case
"Before any man can be considered as a member of Civil Society, he must be
considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe…Religion… [is]
the basis and foundation of government." Misquote of James Madison
"The highest glory of the American Revolution is this; it connected in one
indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of
Christianity. " attributed to John Quincy Adams