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DISCUSSION

Re: is art useless?


well quite.

art is useless cos it can't help me fix my boiler. and i'm cold.

...hey, wait a sec, i could burn the damn paintings!

i take it all back.

also: blah

r.

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>
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Community


hey eric

great idea to make it a commission. internal/proprietary tech teams have
too much to do and not enough time to do it and rhizome is, i assume,
awash with talented, enthused developers who could help out. excluding
people who want to help just makes no sense.

i don't know much about slashdot but my day job is as a flash developer
and i utilise a lot of the open source projects aral balkan hosts at
osflash.org in my work. he's smart enough not to manage the projects
though, he just provides the space (its a wiki) and leaves that to the
community, who are perfectly able and mature enough to do that themselves.

i agree eric: a natural fit. really, rhizome.org should be able to run
itself in the same way that osflash.org does.

r.

> Thats a great post. It sums up what Steven and I have been trying to get
> Rhizmome involved with for awhile (thanks for the lead on this Steve).
> The sourceforge/slashdot approach is a natural fit for Rhizome. I also
> believe that given the that this be a
> future Rhizome Commission ( no voting or jury on this one)
> Eric
> +

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Community


hey alexis

'glad you agree. strangely tho, having suggesting that more people get
involved in the debate, the debate seems to have... stopped.

r.

> Hear, hear! I sound like a fool 95% of the time (the other 5% is, of
> course,
> unadulterated genius), but when do I let that stop me?
> -A.

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Community


HI MANIK!

to ALL:

it's great that the "community" is having this discussion. overdue imo.
two points:

1.
it's always the same old names on this list:
> by Steven Read, Eric Dymond, Lee Wells, Annie Abrahams, Jason Van Anden,
> Lauren Cornell, alexis turner, MANIK, Pall Thayer, Rob Myers, T.Whid,
> beate zurwehme, M. River, Michael Szpakowski, Rob Myers & salvatore
> iaconesi

there MUST be more people than just this subscribing? where are they? if
we want to discuss teh community, the _COMMUNITY should be involved, not
just the _DEFAULT_CONTRIBUTORS. i hardly ever post to this because as
'just some guy' i expect not to be taken [as] seriously. all the other
subscribers must also have their reasons for remaining silent too. this
does not a community make. speak, even if you sound like a fool: learn by
mistakes instead.

2.
steven and eric's posts lead the way i think. imo open-source projects are
a fine way to create community. as a rough outline:

A. 'somewhere' on rhizome users post new projects/proposals. this is like
starting any new [net.art] project except that it's publicly listed as a
project that ANYONE can get involved with AT ANY TIME
B. if its a proposal, all involved get together (how? who cares, msg or
whatever) and work out what's to be done
C. or if it's in-progress other users get involved along the way, if they
want
D. project then owned and developed by a collective instead of an
individual, because even if just one person is building a project, anyone
could come along at any time and help out

the net[.art] result being [i would hope...]:

1. less artworks; but
2. more community-minded, multi-faceted and robust ones

r.

> HI LAUREN!
> MANIK
>
>
> Hi Steven,
>
> I agree with you -- and, at the sake of repeating myself, enhancing
> participation on the site is a goal of ours for this year. We are focusing
> on the ArtBase now -- fixes and also development, so suggestions in this
> area are timely. We're also interested in exploring discussion, like I
> mentioned. There've been various suggestions in terms of changing Raw in
> this thread, and also requests not to change it all... What I think would
> be worthwhile is to explore other forms of discussion that might exist
> across the site. Not everyone feels comfortable exchanging their ideas on
> a listserv, and we'd like to explore platforms for discussion that
> encourage other kinds of voices.
>
> One larger point is that, while all these ideas are productive and will
> lead to changes in the system, this is an ongoing process of community
> formation and transformation. Rhizome's mission is to support the global
> new media art community, and the ways we do this are always going to
> change because the community is always going to require different things.
> And, by community, I mean those on RAW, readers of our publications, our
> organizational subscribers, artists in the ArtBase and the many different
> groups that engage with Rhizome. I say this because I dont want to set up
> an expectation that we're going to solve everything through this
> conversation, but I do think we're making progress. And, the Rhizome staff
> is dedicated to supporting all different branches and manifestations of
> the Rhizome community, in an angoing way.
>
> best, Lauren
>
>
>> I do think this is a great idea. But I also feel that in addition to
> that
>> possibility, people out here are calling for something a little more
> aggressive. Adding a new feature to the commissions cycle, means the
> final
>> product won't be available until the end of 2007. Right? That's a step,
> but perhaps some other projects can be accomplished in parallel. The Art
> Base modules/fixes for instance...
>> Steven Read
>>
>> Lauren Cornell wrote:
>>
>>> Eric,
>>> A couple emails back I mentioned that we were interested in exploring
> this
>>> idea:
>>> > "Rhizome Commissions are looking for interactive new media works
>>> that
>>> > enable the Rhizome community to interact, communicate and otherwise
> get involved in the online community."
>>> It seems like it could be a productive way for people to shape, or
> suggest ways to shape, the Rhizome community. However, given the
> resources
>>> for this program and for Rhizome in general, it should be offered as
>>> one
>>> commission -- not all eleven. It could also make sense that this is the
>>> commission that receives the member vote -- and Rhizome, like a
> commissioned artist, has a year to execute it...
>>> Thanks.
>>> Lauren
>> +
>> -> post: list@rhizome.org
>> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
>> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
>> +
>> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
>> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>>
>
>
>
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>
>
>
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>

DISCUSSION

As a quick example of change (was 'Community')


As a quick example of change,
it’s turning into an anniversary festival,
moving through the system,
RAW should be My complaints, then,
why couldn't Rhizome adopt a First,
of course, As a suggestion,
Many of us seem to believe
And that's just hysterical the instant
We are, all, unwilling to accept
which is actually kind of cute,
dass es immer problematischer wird,
Leave RAW alone please.
I liked it better
with Super User supervision.
It unfortunately has become
fun. It’s totally net art.
If I like it, I’m posting it
Maybe I'm odd,
Don't read everything, but
somehow "crowd out" discussion.
declare an interest here,
I'm looking forward to seeing where this conversation goes,
This is exciting to me,
Patrick really used our massive server
We actually have already begun
And actually, we do have a box
and have an interest in its evolution.
I am reposting what I said,
But seriousely,
This isn't incendiary,
it won't even be considered by the "staff".
I can imagine a community box. I think
it's to much at the bottom
but it's worth a try.
to delirium, to announcements, to
"steal" links and content on the
undestandable inertia
It would bring the
Slashdot approach to project development, where
As a quick example of change, why couldn't Rhizome

by Steven Read, Eric Dymond, Lee Wells, Annie Abrahams, Jason Van Anden,
Lauren Cornell, alexis turner, MANIK, Pall Thayer, Rob Myers, T.Whid,
beate zurwehme, M. River, Michael Szpakowski, Rob Myers & salvatore
iaconesi