Artbase: Joe Zane

On Thursday 20 Mar 2003 4:29 pm, Christopher Fahey [askrom] wrote:
<snip>
> Five artbase works in under 20 minutes, congratulations! :-)
> I don't mean to be petty here - I took a look at them and I kinda like
> Joe Zane's works - but they really do not seem appropriate for the
> rhizome artbase. Is the artbase now accepting "linked art objects" that
> are simply web-based documentation of sculptures and installations? Yes,
> he may use digital technologies in the actual works, but they are not
> net-based or net-accessible any more than the Mona Lisa is.
> I am attracted to the idea of the artbase being very inclusive, but I
> also see the value in some curation. This is not necessarily about the
> quality of the work – it's about the *nature* of the work. Rhizome has
> a particular mission (net-based art) and somebody has to make sure that
> works in the artbase at least fit that description.
> -Cf
Are you not interested in photographys inherent relationship with painting
tho? and photographs translate very well to computers.
There some Art historians who have proved that some of our most lauded works
in painting were produces using pin hole camera technology.
What I find interesting in net art is it's potential for finding bridiges
between the real and the hyperreal………sculptures are pretty real in a
concrete way and although photographing them and uploading the jpegs to a
server is a ruff and clumsy solution it neverthe less links the old with the
new which is undeniably important in art…….innit : )
So even if someone sets up some monitors with nice coulors on them in a
gallery space and posts an mpeg of that instillation to their web space it's
a solution….of sorts….maybe….
Jon

Jon Davey wrote:
> So even if someone sets up some monitors with nice
> coulors on them in a gallery space and posts an mpeg
> of that instillation to their web space it's a solution….
> of sorts….maybe….

It's his solution, but is it his art? IMHO, a web site that contains
only pictures and videos can certainly be considered net-based art. In
the case of the Joe Zane work, however, the web pages in question appear
to present themselves explicitly as *documentation* of works of art, not
as works of art in themselves.

Plenty of art is documentation of other art, of course. But with the
works in question, it doesn't seem like that is his intention. He
doesn't seem to want us to consider these web sites to be art works in
themselves. Even the Rhizome artbase pages describe the actual
sculptures, not the sites-about-the-sculptures. If he *does* intend
these little pop-up windows and quicktime movies (which by the way crash
my browser) to be stand-alone art objects, then to me they are a bit
disappointing. The sculptures are much more interesting, but I don't see
how they could/should fit into Rhizome's domain, which I thought was
about net-based art. Even under a broad definition of net-based art,
sculptures that don't have network connections clearly do not belong.

Note that this is not in any way perjorative to Joe Zane's work!! Gary
Hill and Bill Viola don't belong in Rhizome either, but I love their
tehnology-based installations. A good deal of the technology-based
sculptural works of John Simon, the McCoys, Perry Hoberman, Keith Tyson,
Julia Scher, etc (people who work on both net.art and realworld.art)
also don't belong in Rhizome. Rhizome needs to focus on it's net.art
mission if the collection is to be meaningful, useful, and/or
historically important.

-Cf

[christopher eli fahey]
art: http://www.graphpaper.com
sci: http://www.askrom.com
biz: http://www.behaviordesign.com

Hi Christopher:

The scope of the ArtBase was expanded in March of 2002 to include forms of
new media art (including software art, computer games, and documentation of
new media performance and installation), which had previously been excluded
from the archive.

This new policy was adopted in order to allow room for work of potential
historical significance which at one time may not have met our selection
criteria because it was not networked–even though this work was in most
cases as sophisticated as the networked projects in the archive.

Joe Zane's recent submissions were accepted into the ArtBase as new media
art, with the information provided on his website serving to document the
work.

Best,
Alena


> Jon Davey wrote:
>> So even if someone sets up some monitors with nice
>> coulors on them in a gallery space and posts an mpeg
>> of that instillation to their web space it's a solution….
>> of sorts….maybe….
>
> It's his solution, but is it his art? IMHO, a web site that contains
> only pictures and videos can certainly be considered net-based art. In
> the case of the Joe Zane work, however, the web pages in question appear
> to present themselves explicitly as *documentation* of works of art, not
> as works of art in themselves.
>
> Plenty of art is documentation of other art, of course. But with the
> works in question, it doesn't seem like that is his intention. He
> doesn't seem to want us to consider these web sites to be art works in
> themselves. Even the Rhizome artbase pages describe the actual
> sculptures, not the sites-about-the-sculptures. If he *does* intend
> these little pop-up windows and quicktime movies (which by the way crash
> my browser) to be stand-alone art objects, then to me they are a bit
> disappointing. The sculptures are much more interesting, but I don't see
> how they could/should fit into Rhizome's domain, which I thought was
> about net-based art. Even under a broad definition of net-based art,
> sculptures that don't have network connections clearly do not belong.
>
> Note that this is not in any way perjorative to Joe Zane's work!! Gary
> Hill and Bill Viola don't belong in Rhizome either, but I love their
> tehnology-based installations. A good deal of the technology-based
> sculptural works of John Simon, the McCoys, Perry Hoberman, Keith Tyson,
> Julia Scher, etc (people who work on both net.art and realworld.art)
> also don't belong in Rhizome. Rhizome needs to focus on it's net.art
> mission if the collection is to be meaningful, useful, and/or
> historically important.
>
> -Cf
>
> [christopher eli fahey]
> art: http://www.graphpaper.com
> sci: http://www.askrom.com
> biz: http://www.behaviordesign.com
>
>
>
>
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Alena Williams wrote:

>Hi Christopher:
>
>The scope of the ArtBase was expanded in March of 2002 to include forms of
>new media art (including software art, computer games, and documentation of
>new media performance and installation), which had previously been excluded
>from the archive.
>
>This new policy was adopted in order to allow room for work of potential
>historical significance which at one time may not have met our selection
>criteria because it was not networked–even though this work was in most
>cases as sophisticated as the networked projects in the archive.
>
>
but maybe this kind of work - not networked - can already have room in
another "museus". I think that the most singular thing in Rhizome
ArtBase it is that is the biggest and the most important selection of
net art works - and these work still have no room in another places.
These "not networked works" woud have? Maybe yes, maybe not.

That is a question; another question is that, in time of low resources,
wouldn't be best keep the focus in networked works? Or these new works
don't represent a significative cost for Rhizome?

bye, and congratulations for Rhizome ArtBase,
andrei

–
"First of all you can't be subversive without being subversive to yourself, that's very important. You miss something crucial if you think subversion means to have clearly defined enemies and act against them. The enemy always is always you, too and in the first place."
http://www.koreawebart.org/2001/0100101110101101org.html

[email protected]
fone: 92067436
url: http://www.lelic.ufrgs.br/andrei/
url: http://www.atravesdoespelho.hpg.com.br/

> The scope of the ArtBase was expanded in March of 2002 to
> include forms of
> new media art (including software art, computer games, and
> documentation of
> new media performance and installation), which had previously
> been excluded from the archive.


Oh, okay, cool! :)

-Cf

[christopher eli fahey]
art: http://www.graphpaper.com
sci: http://www.askrom.com
biz: http://www.behaviordesign.com