yawn...

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Quoting "marc.garrett" <[email protected]>:

> Blankyawn…
>
> This list has been hijacked by ugly anti- creative nihilists…
>
> Many members hide behind their comps just watching, not wanting to get
> involved because their 'supposed' valid reputations might get tarnished - yet
> by not acting against such an abomination, being complicit in not taking any
> action, except pressing the 'Block Sender' on their email clients; they
> contribute by ignoring the actual problem & sweeping it under the virtual
> carpet. This place has become a battle ground and I do not wish to be part of
> a place that silenty hopes that it will go away.
>
> All those who are actually bothered by what has been happening, please use
> your voice for achange - for now is the time to change this dispicable
> problem.
>
> I have been using my 'block sender' occassionally, in deleted mails I have
> noticed the horrible shouts/spams by 'Karei', which has been a constant and
> vicious, consecutive list of attacking anyone 'they' fancy to offend, without
> any comeback. Rhizome's solution is for us all to block such activity - but I
> cannot ignore the stench underneath.
>
> Action needs to be taken 'NOW'. I know that everyone else other than the
> obvious killers of joy that is; are fed up with all this depressing non-stop
> hate parade, who wish to take part in mutual sharing of ideas on their own
> terms. Everyone I have spoken to agrees of whom frequents this list; but
> where are they now, where have they been, to stand up against such ugliness?
>
> I long for the imaginative beauty that NN used to splurge on here in
> comparison with the non-stop anti-creative hate that we are all forced to
> consume. At least NN was a lateral thinker - 'Karei', is repetative and
> offers no work of their own, putting down anyone who wishes for more than
> 'emptiness'.
>
> 'Kill their void'
>
> respect to all who are wishing the list to be a better place…
>
> marc

On Saturday, December 21, 2002, at 02:02 PM, marc.garrett wrote:

> yawn…
>
> This list has been hijacked by ugly anti- creative nihilists…
>
> Many members hide behind their comps just watching, not wanting to get
> involved because their 'supposed' valid reputations might get
> tarnished - yet by not acting against such an abomination, being
> complicit in not taking any action, except pressing the 'Block Sender'
> on their email clients; they contribute by ignoring the actual problem
> & sweeping it under the virtual carpet. This place has become a battle
> ground and I do not wish to be part of a place that silenty hopes that
> it will go away.

i don't see it as being hijacked. to me they don't exist at all. if
everyone would simply use their filters the idiots would get no
response and, like over-acting children, eventually tire and go away.

until rhizome realizes that allowing this activity is more harmful to
the list than is helpful the only thing we can do is apply filters
liberally. one middle ground could be that when one signs up to RAW the
welcome email could suggest certain addresses that you may want to
filter out. or, to be even less controversial, some of us could get
together and vote on a list of addresses to be placed on this list and
rhizome could simply point to it in the welcome mail. i'll host it on
mteww.com if you like. one only needs to block 3-4 in my opinion to
make RAW a decent place to hang out.


>
> All those who are actually bothered by what has been happening, please
> use your voice for achange - for now is the time to change this
> dispicable problem.

how? right now i'm fueling their bs by even discussing it. rhizome has
made clear again and again that if you don't like it your only
alternative is to go to RARE. i don't agree, i don't see a problem with
banning disruptive email addresses. but Rhizome won't; i don't know why.

we can't stop them through discussion, derision, peer-pressure, pleas
to logic, pleas for mercy, compliments or any other rhetorical strategy
we try. they FEED off negative response. they NEED attention and since
they have no original ideas the only way they can get it is to start
flame wars. the only answer is to ban disruptive addresses, but rhizome
won't do it. we should try my idea above.

i'll email m.tribe and ask him if he would be into putting something
like this in the RAW welcome mail:

"RHIZOME_RAW is an unfiltered and unmoderated list. Rhizome values the
complete freedom of any individual to post to the RAW list. However,
some longtime members of RAW have suggested a list of email addresses
that you may want to block due to their disruptive behavior on the
list. These members believe that by blocking these email addresses you
will have a more positive experience on RHIZOME_RAW. You may download
this list in TEXT format from http://url"

Does this seem like a good compromise?
–
<t.whid>
www.mteww.com
</t.whid>

> From: "t.whid" <[email protected]>

> how? right now i'm fueling their bs by even discussing it. rhizome has
> made clear again and again that if you don't like it your only
> alternative is to go to RARE.

RARE dont exist
Ivan

–
Ivan Pope
[email protected]
www.ivanpope.com


"Faster, faster, until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death"
Hunter S. Thompson

On Sat, 21 Dec 2002, marc.garrett wrote:

> This list has been hijacked by ugly anti- creative nihilists…

The only anti-creative nihilist here is you :)

> Many members hide behind their comps just watching,

Yes, do knee-jerk them.

> not wanting to get involved because their 'supposed' valid reputations
> might get tarnished

Do guilt trip them.

> - yet by not acting against such an abomination,
> being complicit in not taking any action, except pressing the 'Block
> Sender' on their email clients;

<pulls out a whole stash of government propaganda from ww2>

> they contribute by ignoring the actual problem

That would be because you KNOW the actual problem.

> & sweeping it under the virtual carpet.

And your call for censorship is NOT attempting to "sweep the problem
under the virtual carpet of your delusions".

> This place has become a battle ground

It's always been.

> and I do not wish to be part of a place that silenty hopes that it
> will go away.

Go ask NN about battlegrounds.

> All those who are actually bothered by what has been happening, please
> use your voice for achange - for now is the time to change this
> dispicable problem.

The only "despicable problem" is you.

> I have been using my 'block sender' occassionally, in deleted mails I
> have noticed the horrible shouts/spams by 'Karei',

There haven't been any "horrible shouts/spams" by us, dear.

> which has been a constant and vicious,

We are not vicious.

> consecutive list of attacking anyone 'they' fancy to offend,

We do not "offend". Getting offended is an internally driven mechanism.
You're simply attempting to use "getting offended" as an attempt to
exert control. If you get offended by intelligence, then you have a
problem.

> without any comeback.

Isn't that what you are attempting to do dear?
It's cpmfortable to block, and talk trash, isn't it.

> Rhizome's solution is for us all to block such activity
> - but I cannot ignore the stench underneath.

The only one "stinking" here love is you.

> Action needs to be taken 'NOW'.

YES, MURDER PLEASE!

> I know that everyone else other than the obvious killers of joy that is;

Yes, if you don't play along with Marc garret "you're a killer of joy".
You're either with us, or against us.

> are fed up with all this depressing non-stop hate parade,

Dearest, the only one HATING here is you.
We have no capacity to feel hate :)

> who wish to take part in mutual sharing of ideas on their own terms.

Too bad that is not what you're doing is it.
What's wrong with our sharing OUR ideas on OUR terms?
Nevermind. But you're not sharing ideas.

> Everyone I have spoken to agrees of whom frequents this list;

Lovely. Mob pressure.

> but where are they now, where have they been, to stand up against such ugliness?

The only "ugliness" here comes from your own egotistical idiocy.

> I long for the imaginative beauty that NN used to splurge on here in
> comparison with the non-stop anti-creative hate that we are all forced
> to consume.

Yes, that's exactly what NN did.

> At least NN was a lateral thinker - 'Karei',

NN was a lateral thinker?! :)

> is repetative

No dearest. We are NOT repetitive.
repetitiveness is a perceptual failure on your behalf.
Nothing is ever twice the same. Ask NN about it.


> and offers no work of their own,

Dearest, WE_ offer work as WE see fit.
You are not "owed" work.

> putting down anyone who wishes for more than 'emptiness'.

We are not putting anybody down.
You are the only one putting anyone down.

Nor are we "empty". It doesn't matter how much
you froth at the mouth and spew infantile programmatic idiocy.

> 'Kill their void'

MURDER MURDER> BLOOOOOOOOOOOOOD.

> respect to all who are wishing the list to be a better place…

You're not capable of respect, love.

And here youa re attempting to titillate them to the LAST minute.
If they do as you want them to, they'll get respect.

HA HA HA.

On Sat, 21 Dec 2002, t.whid wrote:

> i don't see it as being hijacked. to me they don't exist at all.

That's funny. If we don't exist, what is the below about?
Oh no, look.. the self-important princess uses "you don't exist"
as a lever for its ego. Tsk.

> if everyone would simply use their filters

If everyone would simply act as a herd. Only if.

> the idiots would get no response and,

The only idiot here is you, twhid :)
Besides, we are not desirous of your "responses"
whicha re largely passive-aggressive feeding attempts.

> like over-acting children,

Nobody is "like" anything dear blind princessa.
And we are not "over-acting" or "children".

> eventually tire and go away.

No, we will NEVER tire =)
Consvious management of energy precludes that.

> until rhizome realizes that allowing this activity is more harmful to
> the list than is helpful the only thing we can do is apply filters
> liberally.

Yes, we are sure that "this kind of activity" is very "harmful"
After all, it's far nicer if everyone floated passively
towards their destruction, bleated occasionally, remained blind,
fucked occasionally, and died.

> one middle ground could be that when one signs up to RAW the
> welcome email could suggest certain addresses that you may want to
> filter out.

Yes, surely. You could also make a gallery of the "undesirables".

> or, to be even less controversial, some of us could get
> together and vote on a list of addresses to be placed on this list and
> rhizome could simply point to it in the welcome mail.

Voting: the mass-enforced dictatorial pressure. Hurrah.

> i'll host it on mteww.com if you like. one only needs to block 3-4 in
> my opinion to make RAW a decent place to hang out.

Ah. It's all about "hang outs". Subjugate net.art to "hang outs".

> how? right now i'm fueling their bs by even discussing it.

You're shoveling bs. That's all. backhandedlya s well.


> we can't stop them through discussion,

Dialogue: the destructive weapon of Babylon.

count 1: "verbal" murder.

> derision,

count 2: "emotional" harrasment

> peer-pressure,

count 3: dictatorial herd stampeding

> pleas to logic,

count 4: what logic? you can't even logic.

> pleas for mercy,

count 5: but we are merciful all the time: you mean pleas for PITY?

> compliments or any other rhetorical strategy we try.

Yes. No brain ape mindfuck tricks.
Now try to relate to an ADULT conscious human.
Without trying to project your fears, prejudices, etc.
Without cheap attempts at base impulse knee-jerking.

> they FEED off negative response.

We do not FEED on anything babycheeks.
Fancy that, that a conscious adult human doesn't need or want
anybody's energy. But we do do manage energy properly,
and yes we DO leave more energetic due to having acted
justly, consciously, resolutely, sincerely.

> they NEED attention

We do not NEED anything abbycheeks. Least of all your ATTENTION.
You're esaily SEDUCED–and MESMERISABLE.
If we wanted your attention we'd take it.
Your "attention" is passive-aggressive and vampiric.
You cannot be so narcissistic as to feel like you've been solicited,
can you?

> and since they have no original ideas the only way they can get it is to start
> flame wars.

There are no "original ideas".
Nor do we engage in flame wars.


> the only answer is to ban disruptive addresses, but rhizome
> won't do it. we should try my idea above.

We should.

> i'll email m.tribe and ask him if he would be into putting something
> like this in the RAW welcome mail:
>
> "RHIZOME_RAW is an unfiltered and unmoderated list. Rhizome values the
> complete freedom of any individual to post to the RAW list. However,
> some longtime members of RAW have suggested a list of email addresses
> that you may want to block due to their disruptive behavior on the
> list.

We are not disruptive. The above would be simply not very
"nice" legally :)

> These members believe that by blocking these email addresses you
> will have a more positive experience on RHIZOME_RAW. You may download
> this list in TEXT format from http://url"
>
> Does this seem like a good compromise?

No, it doesn't.
It's a backhanded censorship attempt.

<if
everyone would simply use their filters the idiots
would get no
response and, like over-acting children, eventually
tire and go away.>
Absolutely - we're all grown ups. I blocked the worst
ages ago & have lost nil sleep over it - I can't help
wishing that people wouldn't *rise* to them and I do
think that before folk decide to hone their wit on the
trolls they should consider the consequences for
everyone else.
Nevertheless on grounds of free speech I'm against a
centralised 'we suggest you block list..', except for
nazis.
There is, however, a deeply prurient part of me
that would love to see the MTAA 'worst of' list.
michael



=====
http://www.somedancersandmusicians.com/

__________________________________________________
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on second thought, i agree; there should be no official or
semi-official 'yawn list' (btw, great name mriver).

of course, MTAA, or m.river, or t.whid or anyone else is free to
publish their own Yawn List on RAW, weekly if they feel the need.


On Saturday, December 21, 2002, at 08:02 PM, Michael Szpakowski wrote:

> <if
> everyone would simply use their filters the idiots
> would get no
> response and, like over-acting children, eventually
> tire and go away.>
> Absolutely - we're all grown ups. I blocked the worst
> ages ago & have lost nil sleep over it - I can't help
> wishing that people wouldn't *rise* to them and I do
> think that before folk decide to hone their wit on the
> trolls they should consider the consequences for
> everyone else.
> Nevertheless on grounds of free speech I'm against a
> centralised 'we suggest you block list..', except for
> nazis.
> There is, however, a deeply prurient part of me
> that would love to see the MTAA 'worst of' list.
> michael
–
<t.whid>
www.mteww.com
</t.whid>

On Sat, 21 Dec 2002, Michael Szpakowski wrote:

> Absolutely - we're all grown ups.

Grown ups? No, dearest.
You are children in adult bodies.
C'est tout.

> I blocked the worst ages ago

"Blocked" the "good" "bad".
Said the "grown up".

> & have lost nil sleep over it

Thea sleep never losea ny sleep.

> - I can't help
> wishing that people wouldn't *rise* to them

Me too. I can't help wishing humans
would act as a herd.

> and I do think that before folk decide to hone their wit

Nobody is "honing their wit" babycheeks.
Infantile imbecilities are not "wit"
nor is egotistical lashing out.

> on the trolls they should consider the consequences for
> everyone else.

The only troll here is you babycheeks.

> Nevertheless on grounds of free speech I'm against a
> centralised 'we suggest you block list..', except for
> nazis.

Likely nazi are the problem.

> There is, however, a deeply prurient part of me
> that would love to see the MTAA 'worst of' list.


Ach! The de-lights of enlightened individuals.

<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV>
<P>without the noise, the list would become another academic listserv</P>
<P>few posts, and fewer participants. <BR>The chaotic makes it valuable where&nbsp;some see yawns others see fine engravings.</P>
<P>sebastian</P>
<P>&nbsp;<BR><BR></P></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;From: "t.whid" <[email protected]>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Reply-To: "t.whid" <[email protected]>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;To: [email protected]
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: yawn…
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 01:28:48 -0500
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;on second thought, i agree; there should be no official or
<DIV></DIV>&gt;semi-official 'yawn list' (btw, great name mriver).
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;of course, MTAA, or m.river, or t.whid or anyone else is free to
<DIV></DIV>&gt;publish their own Yawn List on RAW, weekly if they feel the need.
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;On Saturday, December 21, 2002, at 08:02 PM, Michael Szpakowski
<DIV></DIV>&gt;wrote:
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;<IF DIV <>&gt;&gt; everyone would simply use their filters the idiots
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt; would get no
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt; response and, like over-acting children, eventually
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt; tire and go away.&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;Absolutely - we're all grown ups. I blocked the worst
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;ages ago &amp; have lost nil sleep over it - I can't help
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;wishing that people wouldn't *rise* to them and I do
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;think that before folk decide to hone their wit on the
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;trolls they should consider the consequences for
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;everyone else.
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;Nevertheless on grounds of free speech I'm against a
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;centralised 'we suggest you block list..', except for
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;nazis.
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt; There is, however, a deeply prurient part of me
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;that would love to see the MTAA 'worst of' list.
<DIV></DIV>&gt;&gt;michael
<DIV></DIV>&gt;–
<DIV></DIV>&gt;<T.WHID>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;www.mteww.com
<DIV></DIV>&gt;</T.WHID>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;+ ti esrever dna ti pilf nwod gniht ym tup
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Andre SC