namjune();paik()

Thanks Maya, I appreciate it.

I was sitting at a presentation of a $9000 Synthesizer and as the representative was talking about how elegant it was at reproducing piano and violin sounds, I realized I would rather have one of those early casiotone toy keyboards from the 80's
that sounded like trash. But I don't think the music people make with them is trash at all, in fact, I think there's more value in squeezing something out of a tool organically than there is in picking and choosing which pre-built beautiful part
we'll use. I guess the same goes for visual stuff… it feels more organic, to me, when we're using the tech equivilent of scotch tape and aluminum foil to make something. I'm even sort of afraid to start using php because I'm nostalgic for the
.html file extension. But that's probably a bit silly…

That said, though, different tools for different purposes. I'm rediscovering flash all over again now that I'm doing video work…

-er.

> I was sitting at a presentation of a $9000 Synthesizer and as the
> representative was talking about how elegant it was at
> reproducing piano and violin sounds, I realized I would rather
> have one of those early casiotone toy keyboards from the 80's
> that sounded like trash. But I don't think the music people make
> with them is trash at all, in fact, I think there's more value in
> squeezing something out of a tool organically than there is in
> picking and choosing which pre-built beautiful part
> we'll use. I guess the same goes for visual stuff… it feels
> more organic, to me, when we're using the tech equivilent of
> scotch tape and aluminum foil to make something. I'm even sort of
> afraid to start using php because I'm nostalgic for the
> .html file extension. But that's probably a bit silly…
>
> That said, though, different tools for different purposes. I'm
> rediscovering flash all over again now that I'm doing video work…
>
> -er.

you use the word "organic" twice.

to me, it feels like it doesn't matter whether you use the $9000 synth or
the casiotone. if you're simply making music, you're not going to be
creating anything deeply significant *as art*. you may create something
"organic" but it will have so many antecedants that it is a different kind
of reproduction though it may be nice to listen to and i hope people never
stop doing it. i have the same feeling about simply writing poetry or
novels, or simply making a film, or simply creating an image. all of these
things have been done so deeply and exhaustively. and there *is* new
territory elsewhere. and not simply in 'remix' but in deeper synthesis of
arts and media.

ja
http://vispo.com

> > I was sitting at a presentation of a $9000 Synthesizer and as the
> > representative was talking about how elegant it was at
> > reproducing piano and violin sounds, I realized I would rather
> > have one of those early casiotone toy keyboards from the 80's
> > that sounded like trash. But I don't think the music people make
> > with them is trash at all, in fact, I think there's more value in
> > squeezing something out of a tool organically than there is in
> > picking and choosing which pre-built beautiful part
> > we'll use. I guess the same goes for visual stuff… it feels
> > more organic, to me, when we're using the tech equivilent of
> > scotch tape and aluminum foil to make something. I'm even sort of
> > afraid to start using php because I'm nostalgic for the
> > .html file extension. But that's probably a bit silly…
> >
> > That said, though, different tools for different purposes. I'm
> > rediscovering flash all over again now that I'm doing video work…
> >
> > -er.
>
> you use the word "organic" twice.
>
> to me, it feels like it doesn't matter whether you use the $9000 synth or
> the casiotone. if you're simply making music, you're not going to be
> creating anything deeply significant *as art*. you may create something
> "organic" but it will have so many antecedants that it is a different kind
> of reproduction though it may be nice to listen to and i hope people never
> stop doing it. i have the same feeling about simply writing poetry or
> novels, or simply making a film, or simply creating an image. all of these
> things have been done so deeply and exhaustively. and there *is* new
> territory elsewhere. and not simply in 'remix' but in deeper synthesis of
> arts and media.
>
> ja
> http://vispo.com


how unfortunate for you, jim. just tonight i found two web sites that house
some very beautiful music that doesn't really remind me of much other music.
specifically, Lauri Grohn's site at http://www.synestesia.fi and Michael
Gogin's work at http://www.ruccas.org/index.php?Michael%20Gogins . speaking
of 'reminding me of', i actually heard i think it was a pearl jam song today
where one of the lines of praise is something like 'it doesn't remind me of
anything.'

so, yes, live long enough and it all starts to sound the same, i suppose, so
perhaps you'll just have to surprise yourself with an ability to suspend
judgement?

we know many words but we do not tire of them in combination. a steady
stream of any word, though, will soon be annoying. perhaps we are asked to
see what the world is saying to us in the stream of art we experience.

it does seem that the notion of 'folk art' has been exponentially expanded
by digital media; everyone is famous for 15 Mb, and usually there are only
small parts of it that are in any sense distinct from quite a large number
of other folk's art. the tools of media production are ubiquitous. and of
course this is far preferable to a situation where the tools/means of
production are in the hands of a few. and there will be a whole lotta art. i
mean a *whole* lotta art. and one person's art will be another's data trash.

but if art is important to us, we find our way through it, in it, with it as
through the words of an incantation not heard as such but meaning all the
same what it is to write now, live now, where each history and time period
is in a next room.

best wishes,
ja
http://vispo.com

the search for the "next thing" is a healthy process as long as it's not the only one.

different disciplines have different hearts and follow different paths. maybe converging, but different.

if you look at it from a certain (limited) point of view: painting is "old", sculpture is "old", music is "old". but is it true?

if we answer yes, we're probabily filled up with too many concepts, too much in a hurry, too embedded in The Context.

tools are tools. cost them 3dollars or a million. be them ancient or futuristic.

i love art that is expression of its time. i also love classical art, but i Love that which is contemporary.

but the "new" and the "contemporary" can be found in a violin just like it can be found in a neural network.

salvatore [xDxD]
www.artisopensource.net

A

Art is dead
but sneaks out for fun.

D

Art is invisible:
look at the paintings.

A

Art is dead.
Accept no substitutes.

D

A surd and scream;
black flower,
moon
sun
above.

A

Art is dead
except where strictly prohibited.

D

Art is invisible,
slips past the borders.

ja


> —–Original Message—–
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]On Behalf Of
> Salvatore Iaconesi
> Sent: May 19, 2006 6:46 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: namjune();paik()
>
>
> the search for the "next thing" is a healthy process as long as
> it's not the only one.
>
> different disciplines have different hearts and follow different
> paths. maybe converging, but different.
>
> if you look at it from a certain (limited) point of view:
> painting is "old", sculpture is "old", music is "old". but is it true?
>
> if we answer yes, we're probabily filled up with too many
> concepts, too much in a hurry, too embedded in The Context.
>
> tools are tools. cost them 3dollars or a million. be them ancient
> or futuristic.
>
> i love art that is expression of its time. i also love classical
> art, but i Love that which is contemporary.
>
> but the "new" and the "contemporary" can be found in a violin
> just like it can be found in a neural network.
>
> salvatore [xDxD]
> www.artisopensource.net
> +
> -> post: [email protected]
> -> questions: [email protected]
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>

On 20 May 2006, at 12:28, Jim Andrews wrote:

> Art is dead

"You cannot kill what does not live." - Judge Death.

- Rob.

art is a koan


>– Original Message –
>From: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: namjune();paik()
>Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 04:28:31 -0700
>Reply-To: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
>
>
>A
>
>Art is dead
>but sneaks out for fun.
>
>D
>
>Art is invisible:
>look at the paintings.
>
>A
>
>Art is dead.
>Accept no substitutes.
>
>D
>
>A surd and scream;
>black flower,
>moon
>sun
>above.
>
>A
>
>Art is dead
>except where strictly prohibited.
>
>D
>
>Art is invisible,
>slips past the borders.
>
>ja
>

noise is perfect


salvatore


>– Original Message –
>From: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: namjune();paik()
>Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 04:28:31 -0700
>Reply-To: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
>
>
>A
>
>Art is dead
>but sneaks out for fun.
>
>D
>
>Art is invisible:
>look at the paintings.
>
>A
>
>Art is dead.
>Accept no substitutes.
>
>D
>
>A surd and scream;
>black flower,
>moon
>sun
>above.
>
>A
>
>Art is dead
>except where strictly prohibited.
>
>D
>
>Art is invisible,
>slips past the borders.
>
>ja

It's called "playing the ashiks".
http://www.goldenhorn.com/display.php4?content=records&page=ghp010.html
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004YL8H/ref=nosim/102-9551440-6588152?nQ74

But unfortunately some "friends" of ours think that Marie Antoinette
–and probably all other women–should have her hands worked and scrubbed
to death because they worship handmade goods and some other crap.

Ashik by the way also is referent to the notion of holding or kissing
hands as it were, ashiks being the knucklebones.

Thusly we do beat up every-one pretending to be an "artist" "lover" or
"musician" who tries to put women to physical labor.

Such as the ugly and ignominous Willem de Ridder who exploits his
"beloved" Clary–par example.

CLEARLY Marie Antoinette just wasn't "working" hard enough.

On Thu, 18 May 2006, Jim Andrews wrote:

> Date: Thu, 18 May 2006 12:15:11 -0700
> From: Jim Andrews <[email protected]>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: namjune();paik()
>
>
> > I was sitting at a presentation of a $9000 Synthesizer and as the
> > representative was talking about how elegant it was at
> > reproducing piano and violin sounds, I realized I would rather
> > have one of those early casiotone toy keyboards from the 80's
> > that sounded like trash. But I don't think the music people make
> > with them is trash at all, in fact, I think there's more value in
> > squeezing something out of a tool organically than there is in
> > picking and choosing which pre-built beautiful part
> > we'll use. I guess the same goes for visual stuff… it feels
> > more organic, to me, when we're using the tech equivilent of
> > scotch tape and aluminum foil to make something. I'm even sort of
> > afraid to start using php because I'm nostalgic for the
> > .html file extension. But that's probably a bit silly…
> >
> > That said, though, different tools for different purposes. I'm
> > rediscovering flash all over again now that I'm doing video work…
> >
> > -er.
>
> you use the word "organic" twice.
>
> to me, it feels like it doesn't matter whether you use the $9000 synth or
> the casiotone. if you're simply making music, you're not going to be
> creating anything deeply significant *as art*. you may create something
> "organic" but it will have so many antecedants that it is a different kind
> of reproduction though it may be nice to listen to and i hope people never
> stop doing it. i have the same feeling about simply writing poetry or
> novels, or simply making a film, or simply creating an image. all of these
> things have been done so deeply and exhaustively. and there *is* new
> territory elsewhere. and not simply in 'remix' but in deeper synthesis of
> arts and media.
>
> ja
> http://vispo.com
>
>
> +
> -> post: [email protected]
> -> questions: [email protected]
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>

o
[ + ]

+ + +


| '|' |
_________________________________________
`, . ` `k a r e i' ? ' D42

(wince)

> ——– Original Message ——–
> Subject: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: namjune();paik()
> From: [email protected]
> Date: Sat, May 20, 2006 3:01 pm
> To: [email protected]
>
> art is a koan
>
>
> >– Original Message –
> >From: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Subject: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: namjune();paik()
> >Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 04:28:31 -0700
> >Reply-To: "Jim Andrews" <[email protected]>
> >
> >
> >A
> >
> >Art is dead
> >but sneaks out for fun.
> >
> >D
> >
> >Art is invisible:
> >look at the paintings.
> >
> >A
> >
> >Art is dead.
> >Accept no substitutes.
> >
> >D
> >
> >A surd and scream;
> >black flower,
> >moon
> >sun
> >above.
> >
> >A
> >
> >Art is dead
> >except where strictly prohibited.
> >
> >D
> >
> >Art is invisible,
> >slips past the borders.
> >
> >ja
> >
>
>
>
> +
> -> post: [email protected]
> -> questions: [email protected]
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php