-empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics

Posted by Jim Andrews | Sun Jan 1st 2006 2:04 a.m.

The featured guests of -empyre- in January 2006 are Kenneth Newby, Martin
Gotfrit, Alexandra Dulic, and Andreas Kahre in Vancouver Canada. They are
working together in a project called Computational Poetics that "aims to
articulate a poetics of digital art performance while developing a tool-set
to enable artists working in the computational medium to create, present and
document their work." Computational Poetics is also creating a series of
works combining live animation, performance documentary, and music
techniques for performance and installation. The project involves both
creating art and creating tools for artists. Some of the questions they
consider, along the way, are:

1. How is artistic expression mediated through computing technology or the
logic machine?
2. What useful models can be found for emerging technologies in cultural
traditions outside of contemporary practice?
3. How to support these cultural traditions in the context of computational
art?
4. How does one create applications and processes that demystify the
computer and empower the artist?

You can subscribe to the -empyre- list from http://subtle.net/empyre
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 6:03 a.m.
    no poetics is the new poetics

    komninos

    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • Dirk Vekemans | Sun Jan 1st 2006 6:34 a.m.
    poetics is the new poetics no
    is the new poetics no poetics
    the new is no poetics poetics
    untsoweiter (happy new year)
    dv

    > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    > Van: owner-list@rhizome.org [mailto:owner-list@rhizome.org]
    > Namens Komninos Zervos
    > Verzonden: zondag 1 januari 2006 14:04
    > Aan: Jim Andrews
    > CC: list@rhizome.org
    > Onderwerp: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics
    >
    >
    > no poetics is the new poetics
    >
    > komninos
    >
    > http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    > http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    > http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    > "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale."
    >
    > +
    > -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
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    > the Membership Agreement available online at
    > http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
    >
  • Jim Andrews | Sun Jan 1st 2006 12:26 p.m.
    > no poetics is the new poetics

    > komninos

    I'm reading the novel Snow by Orhan Pamuk. I already knew, from the back
    cover, that the main character is a poet. The first paragraph hooked me:

    "The silence of snow, thought the man sitting just behind the bus driver. If
    this were the beginning of a poem, he would have called the thing he felt
    inside him the silence of snow."

    A beautiful introduction to the mind of a poet, how he traverses feeling and
    language. And also to the poetics of the novelist. A beautiful beginning to
    a real novel involving an imagined beginning to a poem not so much as poem
    but as way of contemplating what he is feeling, feeling it, contemplating.
    Poetics is what we mediate experience and language with.

    'No poetics is the new poetics' doesn't mean no poetics but naive poetics.

    ja
    http://vispo.com
  • Dirk Vekemans | Sun Jan 1st 2006 1:36 p.m.
    Naive poetics. Maybe. It's something that works in most environments.
    Accidently, as it were.
    Otherwise the complete absence of poetics might also be the key condition
    for any formula of poetical engeneering to work. Dehumanise the whole
    shabang instead of trying to inscribe it, allowing the poetical to occur
    instead of trying to resuscitate it from dead or dying collections or
    theoretical fictions based on those, catch and reuse the generated moments,
    the discrete christals of time melting in your field of vision. I wasn't
    trying to ridicule komninos's statement, just showing it could mean lots of
    things, once you start computing...
    dv

    > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    > Van: owner-list@rhizome.org [mailto:owner-list@rhizome.org]
    > Namens Jim Andrews
    > Verzonden: zondag 1 januari 2006 20:27
    > Aan: list@rhizome.org
    > Onderwerp: RE: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics
    >
    > > no poetics is the new poetics
    >
    > > komninos
    >
    > I'm reading the novel Snow by Orhan Pamuk. I already knew,
    > from the back cover, that the main character is a poet. The
    > first paragraph hooked me:
    >
    > "The silence of snow, thought the man sitting just behind the
    > bus driver. If this were the beginning of a poem, he would
    > have called the thing he felt inside him the silence of snow."
    >
    > A beautiful introduction to the mind of a poet, how he
    > traverses feeling and language. And also to the poetics of
    > the novelist. A beautiful beginning to a real novel involving
    > an imagined beginning to a poem not so much as poem but as
    > way of contemplating what he is feeling, feeling it, contemplating.
    > Poetics is what we mediate experience and language with.
    >
    > 'No poetics is the new poetics' doesn't mean no poetics but
    > naive poetics.
    >
    > ja
    > http://vispo.com
    >
    >
    > +
    > -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    > -> subscribe/unsubscribe:
    > http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
    > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
    > +
    > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in
    > the Membership Agreement available online at
    > http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
    >
  • Rob Myers | Sun Jan 1st 2006 1:54 p.m.
    On 1 Jan 2006, at 20:36, Dirk Vekemans wrote:

    > Otherwise the complete absence of poetics might also be the key
    > condition
    > for any formula of poetical engeneering to work.

    As with politics, there's no such thing as the absence of poetics.

    I like the idea of poetics engineering. Like psychohistory or psyops
    for experience.

    - Rob.
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 3:34 p.m.
    poetics or poetrix or poet tricks?

    naive is the new informed

    a quote
    "poets make lousy lovers
    cos half way through
    they think about how it will end"
    jas h duke

    komninos zervos
    lecturer, CyberStudies major
    School of Arts
    Griffith University
    Room 3.25 Multimedia Building G23
    Gold Coast Campus
    Parkwood
    PMB 50 Gold Coast Mail Centre
    Queensland 9726
    Australia
    Phone 07 5552 8872 Fax 07 5552 8141
    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 4:23 p.m.
    a few terms requiring further definition

    artistic expression
    mediated
    computing technology
    the logic machine
    useful models
    emerging technologies
    cultural traditions
    contemporary practice
    computational art
    create
    applications
    processes that demystify
    the computer
    empower
    artist
    komninos

    komninos zervos
    lecturer, CyberStudies major
    School of Arts
    Griffith University
    Room 3.25 Multimedia Building G23
    Gold Coast Campus
    Parkwood
    PMB 50 Gold Coast Mail Centre
    Queensland 9726
    Australia
    Phone 07 5552 8872 Fax 07 5552 8141
    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 4:25 p.m.
    just as we require multiple semiotic systems of interpretation for the
    writing and experiencing of new media (multimedia) art, we would also need
    to call on a variety of poetics to construct such works. we need the
    poetics of the filmmaker and the musician and the choreographer and the
    theatre director and the actor and the trapeze artist and the touch of a
    potter and the poet and the visual artist and the computer programmer and
    the storyteller and the photographer and the quizmaster and the game show
    host and the busker and the street theatre performer,etc etc etc

    perhaps i am suggesting 'computational poetics'(which could mean the
    poetics of computer code or the poetics of new media art experienced
    through computers, i'll assume the latter) has no poetics of it's own but
    combines a variety of poetics with each new work.

    the formula could be
    poetics of computational art = total existing realised poetics to the power
    of all their possible combinations

    this is not allowing for any new actualisations that are realised into new
    poetics

    the total number of possible poetics in play are, if not infinite, a bloody
    lot of possible poetics. and with that many poetics one as a number becomes
    irrelevant.

    that is why i say no poetics is the new poetics

    komninos zervos
    lecturer, CyberStudies major
    School of Arts
    Griffith University
    Room 3.25 Multimedia Building G23
    Gold Coast Campus
    Parkwood
    PMB 50 Gold Coast Mail Centre
    Queensland 9726
    Australia
    Phone 07 5552 8872 Fax 07 5552 8141
    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • Rob Myers | Sun Jan 1st 2006 4:33 p.m.
    On 1 Jan 2006, at 23:23, Komninos Zervos wrote:

    > a few terms requiring further definition

    I'm sorry, I didn't understand a word of that sentence.

    - Rob.
  • Dirk Vekemans | Sun Jan 1st 2006 7:06 p.m.
    I think komninos meant to say he put the soup through a sieve, started
    counting the vegetables, lost his count at carrot nr 8 or so and now he
    wants us to put the whole thing back in the kettle and start cooking again.
    From his references i gather he's about to reverse engineer the process and
    do away with the need for soup altogether, claiming the count doesn't
    matter, the big secret was in the water all the time along.
    dv

    > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    > Van: owner-list@rhizome.org [mailto:owner-list@rhizome.org]
    > Namens Rob Myers
    > Verzonden: maandag 2 januari 2006 0:34
    > Aan: Rhizome Raw list
    > Onderwerp: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics
    >
    > On 1 Jan 2006, at 23:23, Komninos Zervos wrote:
    >
    > > a few terms requiring further definition
    >
    > I'm sorry, I didn't understand a word of that sentence.
    >
    > - Rob.
    > +
    > -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    > -> subscribe/unsubscribe:
    > http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
    > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
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    > the Membership Agreement available online at
    > http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
    >
  • Christina McPhee | Sun Jan 1st 2006 8:25 p.m.
    or, that it was really the stone in the soup

    http://spanky.triumf.ca/www/fractint/stone_soup.html

    cm
    On Jan 1, 2006, at 6:05 PM, Dirk Vekemans wrote:

    > I think komninos meant to say he put the soup through a sieve, started
    > counting the vegetables, lost his count at carrot nr 8 or so and
    > now he
    > wants us to put the whole thing back in the kettle and start
    > cooking again.
    > From his references i gather he's about to reverse engineer the
    > process and
    > do away with the need for soup altogether, claiming the count doesn't
    > matter, the big secret was in the water all the time along.
    > dv
    >
    >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    >> Van: owner-list@rhizome.org [mailto:owner-list@rhizome.org]
    >> Namens Rob Myers
    >> Verzonden: maandag 2 januari 2006 0:34
    >> Aan: Rhizome Raw list
    >> Onderwerp: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics
    >>
    >> On 1 Jan 2006, at 23:23, Komninos Zervos wrote:
    >>
    >>> a few terms requiring further definition
    >>
    >> I'm sorry, I didn't understand a word of that sentence.
    >>
    >> - Rob.
    >> +
    >> -> post: list@rhizome.org
    >> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    >> -> subscribe/unsubscribe:
    >> http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
    >> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
    >> +
    >> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in
    >> the Membership Agreement available online at
    >> http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
    >>
    >
    >
    > +
    > -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    > -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/
    > subscribe.rhiz
    > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
    > +
    > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
    > Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/
    > 29.php
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 8:29 p.m.
    i'm just playing with jim's words, sorry
    as a poet
    that's what i do
    play with words
    i do not mean to be disrespectful to this months guests on empyre
    especially since this discussion is happening on rhizome
    i look forward to what they have to say
    is there anything wrong with questioning?

    cheers
    have fun
    i am
    komninos

    komninos zervos
    lecturer, CyberStudies major
    School of Arts
    Griffith University
    Room 3.25 Multimedia Building G23
    Gold Coast Campus
    Parkwood
    PMB 50 Gold Coast Mail Centre
    Queensland 9726
    Australia
    Phone 07 5552 8872 Fax 07 5552 8141
    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • komninos zervos | Sun Jan 1st 2006 8:37 p.m.
    ah yes that stone soup
    that stone is the same stone, or maybe a different stone, used to cook and
    eat crow.
    place a crow in water, place the stone in the pot and when the stone is
    tender your crow is cooked.

    komninos

    komninos zervos
    lecturer, CyberStudies major
    School of Arts
    Griffith University
    Room 3.25 Multimedia Building G23
    Gold Coast Campus
    Parkwood
    PMB 50 Gold Coast Mail Centre
    Queensland 9726
    Australia
    Phone 07 5552 8872 Fax 07 5552 8141
    http://www.gu.edu.au/ppages/k_zervos
    http://users.bigpond.net.au/mangolegs
    http://spokenword.blog-city.com
    "Our Workplace Rights are NOT for sale.
  • Jim Andrews | Sun Jan 1st 2006 9:30 p.m.
    I'm looking forward to what Kenneth Newby and crew have to say about
    'Computational Poetics'. I said 'poetics is what we mediate experience and
    language with,' but that's from a writerly point of view, unless you want to
    expand the notion of language or/and the writerly to, say, the language of
    film, or the computational, or/and the writer as not solely a writer of
    words but of sounds, images, code, etc.

    None of the four featured guests say in their bio that they are a writer.
    The term 'poetics' shifts slightly in such a light, but we are used to that
    light concerning 'computational poetics' in that, as you point out,
    Komninos, there are often various arts and media and techne involved more or
    less simultaneously.

    So I'm thinking it could be an interesting month of discussion.

    We've posted volumes and the featured guests haven't yet posted to -empyre-.

    Normally what we do is we let at least one of the featured guests post their
    intro before diving in. I think Kenneth Newby is going to post first.

    ja
    http://subtle.net/empyre
    http://vispo.com
  • Dirk Vekemans | Mon Jan 2nd 2006 3:03 a.m.
    lovely story to wake up with, makes my soup taste ugly. It shouldn't, i
    kinda like Komninos' loud style, in fact, so it's only wordplay, too. Hush
    now.
    :
    :
    ;

    (cough)
    :
    .

    .

    dv

    > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    > Van: Christina McPhee [mailto:christina112@earthlink.net]
    > Verzonden: maandag 2 januari 2006 4:25
    > Aan: Dirk Vekemans; list@rhizome.org
    > CC: Komninos Zervos
    > Onderwerp: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06: Computational Poetics
    >
    > or, that it was really the stone in the soup
    >
    > http://spanky.triumf.ca/www/fractint/stone_soup.html
    >
    > cm
    > On Jan 1, 2006, at 6:05 PM, Dirk Vekemans wrote:
    >
    > > I think komninos meant to say he put the soup through a
    > sieve, started
    > > counting the vegetables, lost his count at carrot nr 8 or
    > so and now
    > > he wants us to put the whole thing back in the kettle and start
    > > cooking again.
    > > From his references i gather he's about to reverse engineer the
    > > process and do away with the need for soup altogether, claiming the
    > > count doesn't matter, the big secret was in the water all the time
    > > along.
    > > dv
    > >
    > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
    > >> Van: owner-list@rhizome.org [mailto:owner-list@rhizome.org] Namens
    > >> Rob Myers
    > >> Verzonden: maandag 2 januari 2006 0:34
    > >> Aan: Rhizome Raw list
    > >> Onderwerp: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: -empyre- in jan06:
    > Computational Poetics
    > >>
    > >> On 1 Jan 2006, at 23:23, Komninos Zervos wrote:
    > >>
    > >>> a few terms requiring further definition
    > >>
    > >> I'm sorry, I didn't understand a word of that sentence.
    > >>
    > >> - Rob.
    > >> +
    > >> -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > >> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    > >> -> subscribe/unsubscribe:
    > >> http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
    > >> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
    > >> +
    > >> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
    > >> Membership Agreement available online at
    > >> http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
    > >>
    > >
    > >
    > > +
    > > -> post: list@rhizome.org
    > > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
    > > -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/
    > > subscribe.rhiz
    > > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
    > > +
    > > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
    > > Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/
    > > 29.php
    >
    >
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